Putting the A&E figures in perspective: NHS England patients were more than twice as likely to wait over four hours throughout 2017.

nhs-scotland-logo

This is deeply ironic but I’m grateful to the BBC News website, yesterday, for doing the work for me, on this one

Some of you, not me, will have watched the barely concealed glee as BBC Scotland and other news reporters, announced the fact that only 78% of patients were seen within four hours in the last week of 2017. The freezing weather leading to increases in falls requiring treatment being up by more than 40% in Inverness and a nation-wide doubling of flu cases do, of course, explain what happened but under an SNP administration anything is fair game for the Unionist media.

However, right at the end of a long BBC Scotland News website article, they offer us the contextual information we need to put one bad week in perspective. Here it is:

‘The situation elsewhere in the UK

Last month, BBC analysis of NHS data showed that fewer patients in Scotland were waiting longer than four hours in A&E than they did in 2012/3 in contrast to England where the number had more than doubled.

It found England had a 155% rise in long waits between 2012/3 and this year, up to 2.5 million a year.

Hospitals in Wales and Northern Ireland also saw an increase over the period.

In Scotland, the number of patients waiting more than four hours fell by 9% to just over 100 000.’

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-42620167

Over the whole of 2017, there were 100 000 waits over 4 hours in Scotland (5.3 million population) and 2 500 000 in England (53 million population). This suggests you were two and a half times as likely to do so in England.

Meanwhile, from the Head of Scottish News, or whatever, the propaganda and/or stupidity persists with this:

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23 thoughts on “Putting the A&E figures in perspective: NHS England patients were more than twice as likely to wait over four hours throughout 2017.

  1. The Observer January 11, 2018 / 10:42 am

    Hi, you might want to change your Infographic to show 100,000 – not 100,00

    Like

  2. achmony January 11, 2018 / 10:56 am

    Sarah Smith, just another lying BBC hypocrite. Like so many others who work for that ghastly cretinous organisation.

    Like

    • Alasdair Macdonald January 11, 2018 / 4:41 pm

      Does the BBC never provide corrections for inaccurate reports? Most of the msm have sections where they report these.

      Like

      • johnrobertson834 January 11, 2018 / 4:54 pm

        What inaccurate reports? You’ll get reported to your employer for bring both them and the BBC into disrepute!

        Like

  3. Tony L January 11, 2018 / 11:17 am

    John, I saw a graphic on Twitter published by WoS which suggested that there were less than 15,000 patients who had to wait over 4 hours at A&E in 2017. Taken from the published data. 93.07% seen within the 4 hour target over the year as a whole. So this 100k figure doesn’t exist anywhere. This makes Sarah Smith and the BBCScotland simple propagandists and liars (in my humble opinion).

    Like

  4. Holebender January 11, 2018 / 11:31 am

    It is also worth noting that NHS Scotland and NHS England use different definitions of waiting times. In Scotland the clock starts ticking as soon as the patient arrives at A&E and it keeps ticking until the patient leaves A&E. In England the clock is reset each time the patient is seen by someone. What does this mean? If a patient has to wait over four hours for a bed in Scotland, that’s four hours after first arriving at A&E. If a patient has to wait over four hours for a bed in England, that’s four hours after seeing a doctor who ordered the admission, but the patient might already have waited six hours to be seen by that doctor. In other words, Scotland’s time limit is far more stringent than England’s, yet Scotland’s A&Es are still outperforming England’s.

    Like

  5. Holebender January 11, 2018 / 12:36 pm

    Consider the following scenario: two people go to A&E, one in Scotland and one in England. The English patient waits three hours before being seen by a junior doctor, who decides that the patient needs to be seen by a consultant. The patient waits another three hours for the consultant, who decides the patient must be admitted to a ward. After a further three hour wait the patient is taken to a ward and admitted. The patient was admitted to the ward nine hours after arriving in A&E but is recorded as having met the four hour waiting time target.

    The Scottish patient waits an hour and a half to be seen by a junior doctor, another hour and a half to be seen by a consultant, and is admitted to a ward after waiting a further hour and a half. The Scottish patient is admitted to a ward four and a half hours after arriving in A&E, and is recorded as having missed the four hour waiting time target.

    And yet, even with these different recording methodologies, Scotland’s NHS is outperforming England’s.

    Liked by 1 person

    • johnrobertson834 January 11, 2018 / 5:30 pm

      Sorry HB but I think it’s the same. In NHS England:

      ‘The clock starts from the time that the patient arrives in A&E and stops when the
      patient leaves the [A&E] department on admission [to a ward], transfer from the hospital or discharge.’

      If someone in A&E gets them into ward, then there’s no need to start the clock again because it’s only the time in the A&E department that has a target.

      Like

      • Holebender January 12, 2018 / 9:35 am

        Read the definition in the NHS England document I posted:
        “The waiting time for an emergency admission via A&E is measured from the time
        when the decision is made to admit, or when treatment in A&E is completed
        (whichever is later) to the time when the patient is admitted.
        i) Time of decision to admit is defined as the time when a clinician decides and
        records a decision to admit the patient or the time when treatment that must be
        carried out in A&E before admission is complete – whichever is the later.”

        It’s very clear that times are calculated from the last clinician’s consultation, i.e. all time waiting to see a clinician is counted separately. Decisions to admit are made by clinicians, not receptionists, so the waiting time is always calculated from when a clinician has already seen the patient. It may be different for a discharge from A&E.

        Now read the NHS Scotland definition I posted:
        “95% of all A&E patients should be admitted, discharged or transferred within four hours of arrival at an A&E department across NHS Scotland”

        …within four hours of arrival

        Like

  6. Clydebuilt January 11, 2018 / 1:20 pm

    Just heard on BBC Radio Shortbread that flu admissions are now 4 times what they were this time last year. . . . Need to hear it again not sure if it’s admissions to hospital . . . Or patients attending A & E

    Liked by 1 person

  7. johnrobertson834 January 12, 2018 / 10:03 am

    Thanks HB but the same doc also says:

    ‘The clock starts from the time that the patient arrives in A&E and stops when the
    patient leaves the [A&E] department on admission [to a ward], transfer from the hospital or discharge.’

    Does:

    i) Time of decision to admit is defined as the time when a clinician decides and
    records a decision to admit the patient or the time when treatment that must be
    carried out in A&E before admission is complete – whichever is the later.”

    mean admit to a ward after the A&E department?

    I’m confused

    Anybody else have thoughts on this – Alasdair, Ludo, Clydebuilt…….?

    Like

    • Holebender January 12, 2018 / 12:50 pm

      My feeling is that NHS England is counting a single A&E visit as multiple events, i.e. the time from arrival to seeing a doctor and the time from seeing a doctor to final disposal are treated as two separate times, which would make it easier to achieve targets.

      Liked by 1 person

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